Im new here and have some questions

[InfinitEndz]

So Ive been wanting to build a voron for a while and theres so much information all over the place that for me its a little overwhelming so im hoping if I list my goals maybe I can get some good suggestions. For starters im in the US. The end goal is to make a toolchanger. I think itd be really cool to make a toolchanger that can not only handle really soft tpus but also be able to print high temperature filaments, pps-cf, ppa-cf, pc cf etc. I just recently stumbled across the doomcube mod and that definitely interests me. But is there a decent kit that comes with the 4040 rails? Id like to have a heated bed that does at least 120c and a toolhead/toolheads that can print at least 330-350c. Ive always made the assumption that toolhead temps are mainly a firmware modification as long as the hardware can handle it. Yes my account is brand new and yes im a little all over the place, but im trying to get a little more active in this community because theres an amazing amount of knowledge here and Id love some guidance. Thank you!

 

[vinnycordeiro]

Welcome!

Let's start with your goal: building a toolchanger. That's an advanced mod, and there are a handful of options out there, but I'd suggest you to first build your printer as stock as possible, setting it up and making sure that it works, then start modding it. This way you will get more help because there's more people with experience with a stock printer that can help you troubleshoot any problems you might have.

Concerning high temperature filaments, beware that a VORON is designed to print ABS as properly as possible, some of the more demanding filaments may push the printed parts beyond their limits. You'll need to make your own research about that. And yes, you can set the max temperature of the hotend on the printer configuration file on Klipper, just make sure to set one that can be safely reached by your hotend of choice.

As for DOOMcube mod's 4040 extrusions, you have two options:

• you can buy the extrusions from Misumi, that is the original extrusion for the mod. You can even choose between square or rounded corner extrusions. Using these extrusions you'll reuse the four vertical extrusions from a stock V2.4, you just bolt the extra extrusions on them;
• LDO manufactures (manufactured?) a conversion kit with an extrusion designed by the creator of the DOOMcube mod, some US-based stores still have the kit for sale like West3D. Using this kit you replace the four vertical extrusions of a V2.4 entirely.

If you have more questions don't be shy to ask them.

 

[5twenty]

If you ever need parts, in varying colors and sizes....dllpdf.com is a great custom jobber for extrusions. And Bert is easy to work with, if you need more customized options.

The above advice is pretty sound...I also suggest waiting, though it adds a bit of complication, it ensures your printer works correctly before fiddling with more boards and connections.

 

[InfinitEndz]

Welcome!

Let's start with your goal: building a toolchanger. That's an advanced mod, and there are a handful of options out there, but I'd suggest you to first build your printer as stock as possible, setting it up and making sure that it works, then start modding it. This way you will get more help because there's more people with experience with a stock printer that can help you troubleshoot any problems you might have.

Concerning high temperature filaments, beware that a VORON is designed to print ABS as properly as possible, some of the more demanding filaments may push the printed parts beyond their limits. You'll need to make your own research about that. And yes, you can set the max temperature of the hotend on the printer configuration file on Klipper, just make sure to set one that can be safely reached by your hotend of choice.

As for DOOMcube mod's 4040 extrusions, you have two options:

• you can buy the extrusions from Misumi, that is the original extrusion for the mod. You can even choose between square or rounded corner extrusions. Using these extrusions you'll reuse the four vertical extrusions from a stock V2.4, you just bolt the extra extrusions on them;
• LDO manufactures (manufactured?) a conversion kit with an extrusion designed by the creator of the DOOMcube mod, some US-based stores still have the kit for sale like West3D. Using this kit you replace the four vertical extrusions of a V2.4 entirely.

If you have more questions don't be shy to ask them.

Hey i appreciate this alot! It seems to be the general consensus that I should start with the base kit and build up from there so ill probably do that. It kind of works out because I like always having a project. My biggest struggle is the overwhelming choices so keeping it simple will help keep my mind on track. Thank you

 

[failingwhetherangrily]

So Ive been wanting to build a voron for a while and theres so much information all over the place that for me its a little overwhelming so im hoping if I list my goals maybe I can get some good suggestions. For starters im in the US. The end goal is to make a toolchanger. I think itd be really cool to make a toolchanger that can not only handle really soft tpus but also be able to print high temperature filaments, pps-cf, ppa-cf, pc cf etc. I just recently stumbled across the doomcube mod and that definitely interests me.

Okay, some misconceptions.

Tool-changer, engineering filaments that require a heated chamber, and TPU. Woah! Straight to the deepest end of the pool. You are looking at 4-6 grand budget there, assuming you have proper tools.

But is there a decent kit that comes with the 4040 rails?

AFAIK, no kit comes with 4040 as a standard. I could be wrong... if anyone knows, share the link.

Id like to have a heated bed that does at least 120c and a toolhead/toolheads that can print at least 330-350c. Ive always made the assumption that toolhead temps are mainly a firmware modification as long as the hardware can handle it. Yes my account is brand new and yes im a little all over the place, but im trying to get a little more active in this community because theres an amazing amount of knowledge here and Id love some guidance. Thank you!

Okay. Mmmmm hold up. This is honestly too much.

If I had 4-6 grand to throw at this problem I would do it differently. I would build two printers instead of 1 uber-omega-end-game printer. Why? Well it's like asking a car to also be a boat, you can do it... but it's going to cost you.

First, if I'm really interested in a tool-changer I would build an open printer (no enclosure what so ever or at the very least simple acrylic panels). I would set that machine as my dedicated multi-color PLA beast.

Then, I would build a smaller printer that I'm able to enclose easily. That takes 2.4 out of the equation because the belt path on the Z axis makes it really tedious to enclose. Rolohaun printers is working on a very nice cubed designed that would make a pretty awesome enclosed printer (requirement for chamber heating and printing with engineering grade filaments). If you don't like the Rolohaun, I think the Trident is your best bet. Figure out what chamber temperature you need, then work you way backwards from there.

Also... I'm assuming you don't have all the tools... get two pairs of 123 block, two pairs of calipers, make sure you have an excellent surface to build your frame on (read instructions), a good set of calipers, a meter long metal ruler, large zip ties, belt tuning tool (buy or print in advance), heated insert insertion tool (DIY or print in advance).

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Honestly, this topic is too big.

The first thing you need to tell us is how much is your budget and what experience you have building things. Are you okay with soldering? crimping wires? do you even have time to build? So many factors. Do you have 2 rolls of PLA to tune your machine after you build it?

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If you have the budget and the skills, I would self source and make my frame 4040 from the start. Have the factory do the holes for you for a clean look. Then, build a standard printer. After you tune it, then buy the tool changer. Then, if you still want to print with a heated chamber build a smaller machine that can handle the volume of the mechanical parts you might need (sub 300mm is usually fine for this).

Hope this helps!

 

[failingwhetherangrily]

OH! also check Scott Corn:

... and once you are done building: Ellis Tuning guide.

 

[lord-carlos]

Tool-changer, engineering filaments that require a heated chamber, and TPU. Woah! Straight to the deepest end of the pool. You are looking at 4-6 grand budget there, assuming you have proper tools.

Do those really need a heated chamber? With CF in them they should not warp that much. And with the bed running at 120C a voron should get pretty toasty no?
I remember printing non-CF PC-blend on a Prusa mk3 inside a closed. Though that was mostly smaller items like part cooling shrouds.

Qidi and Bambulabs sell those filaments for their printers, and AFAIK they only go to 60C chamber.

 

[pajtaz]

So Ive been wanting to build a voron for a while and theres so much information all over the place that for me its a little overwhelming so im hoping if I list my goals maybe I can get some good suggestions. For starters im in the US. The end goal is to make a toolchanger. I think itd be really cool to make a toolchanger that can not only handle really soft tpus but also be able to print high temperature filaments, pps-cf, ppa-cf, pc cf etc. I just recently stumbled across the doomcube mod and that definitely interests me. But is there a decent kit that comes with the 4040 rails? Id like to have a heated bed that does at least 120c and a toolhead/toolheads that can print at least 330-350c. Ive always made the assumption that toolhead temps are mainly a firmware modification as long as the hardware can handle it. Yes my account is brand new and yes im a little all over the place, but im trying to get a little more active in this community because theres an amazing amount of knowledge here and Id love some guidance. Thank you!

Hi. Let us focus on the "high temperature filaments" and what is required to print them in terms of hardware.
1. In order to print either of the 3 filaments you suggested, you need to dry the filament at 100C to 130C. Therefore you need a dedicated filament dryer (oven really) that can reach those temperatures in order to dry the filament before you even start printing it. This is required, not an option. No, commercial filament dryers cannot dry these filaments, maybe, just maybe Sunlu FilaDryer E2 which goes to 110C and costs 3 times more than airfryer ovens that can reach up to 220C.
2. Two of the three filaments you suggested (PPA-CF, PPS-CF) are semi-crystalline, which means they can be printed in lower chamber temps then annealed. Lower chamber temps = 65C or less. That can be done in Voron but then you have to anneal them, and for that again you need an oven and lots of time since they are annealed at 100 to 160C for many hours.
3. Here comes the game changer; if you want to print all 3 filaments in their optimal conditions and without annealing, you need: PPA-CF = 100C+ chamber; PC-CF = 110C+ chamber and 135C+ bed; PPS-CF = 135C+ chamber and 145C+ bed. Almost all of the hardware in a Voron will not survive these temperatures: linear rail end caps will melt; typical grease in rails and bearings will evaporate; connectors will melt/soften/lose functionality; motors will overheat; fans will die; printed parts will melt; can't cool the hotend since hotend fan will die; can't cool the print since part fan will die; bed magnet will lose pull force and will degrade/fall apart; and so on. Therefore you can't just start with even Doom Voron then "upgrade". You have to either make a different printer from scratch or make two printers.
4. I do not know much about toolchangers but considering what I just wrote above, I can't see how you would make a toolchanger work in 120C chamber.

Finally, in case you want to print PPS-CF without annealing, you will not be able to do it without at least 135C+ chamber (anything between 65C and 135C will cause warping). Going above 130C chamber temp you can't even have the motion system inside the chamber and standard Voron or other CoreXY similar designs cannot be used. Therefore even if you went with "standard" motion system printer, most hardware inside the chamber cannot be selected such that it survives above 130C.

Therefore, consider two printers, where the first one is normal Voron and second one is high temp printer but that will cost you minimum 3k USD, probably closer to 5k USD.