Bed fan mod with 24V bed

[sachin patil]

Hi, I am new to 3d printing and new to this forum as well.
I am building core xy printer by my own with heated chamber. After doing many many research on internet, I came to the conclusion that I should build a chamber with bed fan (2x 4020 blower fans). I have 200W aluminium 310x310x3mm size heated bed available in my printer. Printer is powered by 24V supply.
My target is to build heated chamber with min temp 60C to print ABS and ASA.
I use marlin so I am thinking to connect bed fans to the exhaust fan pin. I am using SKR 2 board.

Also I am planning to have exhaust fan with servo controlled vent to the chamber. And there will display with encoder to set the desired temperature. When chamber temp will be go beyond target temp, exhaust fan will on. This whole setup will be Independently controlled by arduino.

Will these setups work? Whats your opinion?

 

[NoGuru]

Sounds like you have over complicated the setup.
Active heated chambers are not allowed to be discussed on this forum. Passive heated (AKA Bed Fans) can be.
Just build a Voron 2.4 and be done. Also why would you run Marlin, its pretty terrible to work with unless you like compiling the firmware and flashing every time you want to make a change.

 

[sachin patil]

Hey. Thanks for your quick response. I understand. But my point was not about making active heated chamber. I was talking about bed fans mod only. I still would like to know is it sufficient to use 24V 200W bed with two 4020 blowers as a bed fans to maintain 60C temp in my printer. Had anyone tried this?

And I use Marlin because I started with Marlin when i entered in 3D printing hobby 4 years back and not explored other firmware. About klipper, My understanding is that I need raspberry pi to modify the firmware. And currently i dont want to invest time and money in raspberry pi as I am bit familiar with Marlin now. Definately will explore klipper as well in future.

 

[shiftingtech]

Your 200w isn't even close to powerful enough for an abs printer, unfortunately. I doubt that a 200w, 300mm bed will even get to abs printing temperatures, much less have sufficient additional capacity to provide heat for bed fans. For comparison, a voron of similar size generally uses a 650w mains powered bed.

As for your comment about klipper "needing a pi to modify the firmware", it's not wrong, yet somehow doesnt feel right either: the pi is ...everything in klipper. It's not just used for "modifying the firmware", it's the entire brain of the printer.

 

[sachin patil]

So, there is no other way instead of using mains power for bed. Actually I dont want to go with high voltage.. would like to work with 24V max. I know 650w power using 24v will require very high current and not a practically feasible solution. Looks like need to figure out something different. But definately i am not going to use active heated chamber.

And thanks for clarifying about pi.

 

[shiftingtech]

Is there a specific reason you're reluctant to do mains bed? As long as you use the appropriate thermal fuses and such, it's still a safe thing...

 

[NoGuru]

I don't just say this because this is a Voron forum but because it will be easier on you to build a Voron kit and then it will open your eyes to see that once you do this you can start making custom machines and see what it entails to do so.
Trust me when I say, I worked with Marlin for YEARS and I will never touch it again after running Klipper. That is how superior it is to Marlin.

 

[sachin patil]

@NoGuru , you might be right because I never used klipper so I dont know its potential.. I am feeling that I should explore that..

@shiftingtech , I am bit reluctant because my printer is having moving bed up and down with 3 lead screw and guide rods. Since its moving so bed AC wires will be moving. Again if i am using AC bed so I need to have proper earthing to it. So using AC supply (high volt) adds so many precautionary checks.
But in other hand, Its true that I need to increase bed wattage around 500 to 600w and that not really feasible with 24V supply. Hope I should give a try to AC bed. Can you please share circuit with required protections to it?

 

[NoGuru]

@NoGuru , you might be right because I never used klipper so I dont know its potential.. I am feeling that I should explore that..

@shiftingtech , I am bit reluctant because my printer is having moving bed up and down with 3 lead screw and guide rods. Since its moving so bed AC wires will be moving. Again if i am using AC bed so I need to have proper earthing to it. So using AC supply (high volt) adds so many precautionary checks.
But in other hand, Its true that I need to increase bed wattage around 500 to 600w and that not really feasible with 24V supply. Hope I should give a try to AC bed. Can you please share circuit with required protections to it?

Read this manual on the Voron Trident, it has the same design you mentioned and all the information on how to build and setup one. https://vorondesign.com/voron_trident

 

[claudermilk]

@NoGuru just beat me. As he just said, the Trident is a moving bed with mains wiring. Mine is now over three years old and probably pushing 3000 hours print time. And it's not the oldest Trident (or V1) by a long shot. Properly built, it's not a problem.

 

[sachin patil]

Now I have decided to shift to Klipper from Marlin. Once I am done with klipper then I will get back to the passive heated chamber modifications.
I ordered Raspberry Pi 4B 4GB.
There is SKR 2 and Reprap discout display controller available on existing printer.
Can I operate my printer without octoprint by using a display controller? Means If I install any plugin from octoprint and then I close the octoprint and try to operate printer using display controller. Will those plugins still be there or they will go with octoprint?

 

[NoGuru]

Now I have decided to shift to Klipper from Marlin. Once I am done with klipper then I will get back to the passive heated chamber modifications.
I ordered Raspberry Pi 4B 4GB.
There is SKR 2 and Reprap discout display controller available on existing printer.
Can I operate my printer without octoprint by using a display controller? Means If I install any plugin from octoprint and then I close the octoprint and try to operate printer using display controller. Will those plugins still be there or they will go with octoprint?

You don't need to use Octoprint anymore. When you switch to Klipper you will have a web portal such as Mainsail or Fluid. I think most use Mainsail but it is a web portal interface to the printer.

When you access it you can full control the printer including the code and macros right from the Web Portal. If that does not make sense now you can just follow the Voron Docs to get everything installed or use KIAUH and it does pretty much all of it for you.
I think your mind is gong to be blown at how much better this is then Marlin with Octoprint.

 

[claudermilk]

A lot of the Octoprint plugins are already part of Klipper. As @NoGuru stated, your main interface will be the web portal. You can also install a touch screen on the printer and run KlipperScreen. You also have the options of Mobileraker to control/monitor it from your phone. A final more obscure option is the Moonraker integration for Home Assistant--this can even allow remote access via the HA app after you're set up a dashboard.

 

[sachin patil]

Actually I wanted to know about controlling the printer using reprap discount display controller. Its true that I can access printer through web portals and through phone as well. But i am trying to make my printer a standalone machine as much as possible. Just put prints in SD card, say go ahead and thats it. This might sound ugly to you.
And I dont want to invest in touch screen as I have 2 reprap screens (big and small) laying around and also I am tight in budget as of now

I am bit confused or not sure. Please correct me If I am wrong. My understanding is if I add any plugins/macros through web portals into raspberry pi, those will be functional till my printer is connected with perticular web portal. And If I access printer through reprap display controller, those plugins will not be functional if that perticular web portal will be dissconnected with the printer at that time. Is that understanding correct?
Actually, I can directly experiment the things but my pi shipment is in-transit now. And I dont want to seat idle by that time.

@NoGuru, thanks for providing KIAUH link. That will be very helpful. I never used octoprint with marlin. I am using marlin through display controller only and giving gcode through SD card manually. so I dont know about any web portal things just saw some videos on youtube. But definately would like to explore that as well.

@claudermilk , thank you for the response. even though most of the Octoprint plugins are part of the Klipper firmware, I think 'Power loss recovery' is still missing there If I not wrong and its available in some web portals. I would love to add that feature to the printer.

 

[NoGuru]

If you have a macro, it will be available from the time you create it, no matter where you access it, web or display.

I slice and send files right to the printer. I guess you do not need to connect it to your network but it makes it very easy to manage. Let us know if you get stuck or have anymore questions. We are happy to help.

 

[sachin patil]

Ok.. Got it.. I will receive my pi tomorrow. Now its time to experiment in a real.
I will surely get back to you guys if I stuck somewhere.

 

[claudermilk]

I'm not familiar with the RepRap screen. I took a quick look at their product web page & it appears it connects via EXP1 and EXP2 ports. I see the Octopus has those ports, so I'm betting there's a way to make it work.

I will say that I can run my Trident without a PC web interface just from the KlipperScreen panel. I've extended one of the Pi USB ports out to the skirt so I can plug into that if I ever needed to transfer files that way. The nice thing with Vorons is you can set them up to operate how you need--like a case such as this.

 

[sachin patil]

I will start experimenting now.

I received my pi today. Looks like its not damaged. But it looks bended at the center. Is it originally like this or I have received a defective one? I have attached image here

 

[NoGuru]

I mean, PCB's should be flat.
The tracers on a PI are pretty durable and I don't think that will cause you any issues.