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Question First Build Advice please

DoctaShed

Member
Ok, firstly i would like to take the time to thank all those who take the time to help me with my questions.

I am begining my Voron 2.4 journey, if it had been, just buy the printer and use it i would have taken the plunge the first time i saw one,

However The nature of the printer has forced me to learn about it and here in lies my dilema, after watching a ton of videos showing builds & countless mods im stuck.

For my build i would like quality first, Flexable choice of materials, I would like a 350mm print area/bed. Running Klipper so electronics is to be decided although im running a Bigtreetech GTR 1.0 on another of my printers and i am very happy with it so was considering the Manta M8P and a PI 4 compute Module i Already own.

Beyond that The Revo Rapid change.

I dont really want to do a standard build and then spend a load more cash and time doing upgrades, if its not to much to ask could you give me some suggetions to which mods are worth the time so i can start with them at the beginning,

i would also like some input on Canbus.

I hope that is not to broad a question

Many Thanks
Rick
 
Welcome to a great journey! Take your time and enjoy the ride.

I was in the same position at the beginning of the year, but quickly turned to kits because the sourcing seemed quite a chore. I turned to formbot. Mostly because it included precrimped and terminated wires of the correct length and had an european shipping centre.

The quality was good, most errors and problems during the build stemmed from user error not a fault in the material. Time will tell how well the bearings, rails and motors hold up.

Btw, formbot is now configured for stealthburner as a standard. LDO is the high-quality route and you can even choose the frame color. Sowol is an interesting newcomer if you want it all at once (they include printed parts so it's a completed ...whose quality is not yet tested. Test of the first edition v0.2? had to be reprinted..), buyers beware...
Read up on vendors and maybe ask around the forums and discord.

PIF is probably best for parts (and keeps the reprap-ethos alive!)

Revo is nice and at the moment a good choice. Maybe the high-flow nozzle will even make the 40W heater better, if you have the choice and money, maybe hold out for the 60W core.

If you want it simple go Tap.. Needs however some deep study of instructions and keeps you on your toes while building and configuring. Especially if you want it during the first build.
The end result rewards you with a great QOL improvement...

When (not if) I get problems in my wiring, canbus will be a good option, by then I'll have enough confidence in the config file and the inner workings of the machine to attempt the operation..

Oh.. if you don't absolutely need a 350 build volume, go for a smaller build. I did the 350, was too greedy. While the space in the electronics bay is nice, the handling is cumbersome and the risk of errors and imperfections increase just because of the sheer size.

Good Luck!
 
I may be the odd man but I had no luck with canbus. It is a whole learning curve unto itself.
I would suggest getting all the bugs worked out and get comfortable with your printer before you start exploring canbus.
 
Welcome to a great journey! Take your time and enjoy the ride.

I was in the same position at the beginning of the year, but quickly turned to kits because the sourcing seemed quite a chore. I turned to formbot. Mostly because it included precrimped and terminated wires of the correct length and had an european shipping centre.

The quality was good, most errors and problems during the build stemmed from user error not a fault in the material. Time will tell how well the bearings, rails and motors hold up.

Btw, formbot is now configured for stealthburner as a standard. LDO is the high-quality route and you can even choose the frame color. Sowol is an interesting newcomer if you want it all at once (they include printed parts so it's a completed ...whose quality is not yet tested. Test of the first edition v0.2? had to be reprinted..), buyers beware...
Read up on vendors and maybe ask around the forums and discord.

PIF is probably best for parts (and keeps the reprap-ethos alive!)

Revo is nice and at the moment a good choice. Maybe the high-flow nozzle will even make the 40W heater better, if you have the choice and money, maybe hold out for the 60W core.

If you want it simple go Tap.. Needs however some deep study of instructions and keeps you on your toes while building and configuring. Especially if you want it during the first build.
The end result rewards you with a great QOL improvement...

When (not if) I get problems in my wiring, canbus will be a good option, by then I'll have enough confidence in the config file and the inner workings of the machine to attempt the operation..

Oh.. if you don't absolutely need a 350 build volume, go for a smaller build. I did the 350, was too greedy. While the space in the electronics bay is nice, the handling is cumbersome and the risk of errors and imperfections increase just because of the sheer size.

Good Luck!
Hi Upperbottom, Thanks so much for Getting back to me, I have really struggled with the sheer amount of routes there are and may even go down the same route as yourself and get a kit as long as i can get to choose what upgrades are included it will remain a possibility. But that was my reason for posting here, to find a concensus . Yes i had read about tap and that is definitely on the list. I will of course keep posting on here and let you all know. Im sure its going to be a steap learning curve.

Rick
 
I may be the odd man but I had no luck with canbus. It is a whole learning curve unto itself.
I would suggest getting all the bugs worked out and get comfortable with your printer before you start exploring canbus.
Hey Eremius, thanks, Its certainly going to be a steap learning curve for sure, im hoping the speed at which the tech evolves in the Voron community means that by the time i do this there will be as simpler solution to the complexities of the upgrades i choose as possible, I will watch as many videos and tutorials as possible. I am lucky in the fact this is not my first 3d printer build and my first was full of mistakes and solutions. it is however my first attempt at something this big and complex.

Rick
 
Well it is a broad question but I will give some input.

The stock printer works great for most material. Budget and a semi pre built vs self sourced will really help to determine the route. If go with a kit, LDO is the way.

I would say TAP is very very good for most people or Beacon. Both have pros and cons but in terms of repeatability and durability I think they are the best. My choice is Beacon, but I like how light it is.

CAN bus is very nice but I will never recommend it for a mod as you build. Currently it is not very easy or straight forward for most people, and most struggle with it.
A great alternative would be an Umbilical line, but it will be a little bulky with all the wires, but then you have not chains, or less chains which is nice.

PANEL hinge! I love these but you have to do a few test prints to make sure they are the right size for you. https://github.com/VoronDesign/VoronUsers/tree/master/printer_mods/richardjm/snap-latch-2020

I also like ACM panels for the deck and back but that will be up to your budget.
 
Well it is a broad question but I will give some input.

The stock printer works great for most material. Budget and a semi pre built vs self sourced will really help to determine the route. If go with a kit, LDO is the way.

I would say TAP is very very good for most people or Beacon. Both have pros and cons but in terms of repeatability and durability I think they are the best. My choice is Beacon, but I like how light it is.

CAN bus is very nice but I will never recommend it for a mod as you build. Currently it is not very easy or straight forward for most people, and most struggle with it.
A great alternative would be an Umbilical line, but it will be a little bulky with all the wires, but then you have not chains, or less chains which is nice.

PANEL hinge! I love these but you have to do a few test prints to make sure they are the right size for you. https://github.com/VoronDesign/VoronUsers/tree/master/printer_mods/richardjm/snap-latch-2020

I also like ACM panels for the deck and back but that will be up to your budget.
Hi NoGuru,
Thanks for your input, Although i am considering a Kit the Jury is still out as although i think its less hassle i think the kits i have looked at although good quality have limiting factors to my choices. Now this is why i posted the question in the first place, you mentioned "Beacon" i had never heard of it. So about 5 videos later here i am, i must admit the speed it does a bed mesh beats the Tap hands down so what you have done is give me another train of thought and i really thank you for that, make no mistake i will take a couple of days to read and watch as much material on the beacon as i can. With the CAN question i have digested a huge amount of information regarding it and i think what may be scary to some is its configuration and the extra coding involved, the hardware itself seems quite streight forward. As for the coding and configuration im not too phased by it either, i have a little experience from a past life as a software engineer. As for the snap latches i was sold the moment i followed your link :) They look fab. Now the ACM panels do look like a great option having better UV light, heat, age and enviroment stability so like you say they would make an ideal back and bottom panel, as for the cost... Well that ship sailed the moment i decided to go down the Voron Route and to be fair i want quality and longevity so ACM is definitly in the running.

Again thanks so much for your input and i hope we speak again.

Regards
Rick
 
Here's my 2 cents...unless you are already experienced with this style of machine, don't try to put too many mods on the printer from the very start. It exponentially adds complexity to the build. As so many others often suggest, start stock and build up from there. I just finished my very first Voron build (a Formbot V0.2 kit), and before I did it, I was asking about making mods from the start and I heard this exact same advice. I thought to myself "nah, those people are nuts, this won't be a problem for me." I didn't listen to them. As it just so happens, building it stock was the only way I could do it at the time for personal reasons, and holy crap am I glad that's how it went! Building stock is the simplest and easiest, with the best availability of clear instructions, and it's already a project not for the faint of heart as is. Starting simple will allow you to make sure you have built the machine correctly each step of the way without being tangled up in all the adjustments that the mods induce (instructions for which are often scattered all over the internet, poorly written, and sometimes even contradictory). As I later found out when performing several mods to my machine simultaneously, it took twice as long to find the instructions and compile the correct order to do them in than the combined time it took to build the machine stock and then actually install the mods. They have been by far the most frustrating part of the whole thing. However, it was motivating to have already built the machine and seen it in action, providing a heartfelt validation that it could be done. That helps keep you to keep pushing through the mod frustration later.

Hopefully this doesn't scare you, because truthfully the build is a LOT of fun. I for one am very happy with it all, even with the modding. Just keep in mind, experienced advice is experienced for a reason; consider it carefully. Life is so much better that way; I need to work on it more myself too.
 
Here's my 2 cents...unless you are already experienced with this style of machine, don't try to put too many mods on the printer from the very start. It exponentially adds complexity to the build. As so many others often suggest, start stock and build up from there. I just finished my very first Voron build (a Formbot V0.2 kit), and before I did it, I was asking about making mods from the start and I heard this exact same advice. I thought to myself "nah, those people are nuts, this won't be a problem for me." I didn't listen to them. As it just so happens, building it stock was the only way I could do it at the time for personal reasons, and holy crap am I glad that's how it went! Building stock is the simplest and easiest, with the best availability of clear instructions, and it's already a project not for the faint of heart as is. Starting simple will allow you to make sure you have built the machine correctly each step of the way without being tangled up in all the adjustments that the mods induce (instructions for which are often scattered all over the internet, poorly written, and sometimes even contradictory). As I later found out when performing several mods to my machine simultaneously, it took twice as long to find the instructions and compile the correct order to do them in than the combined time it took to build the machine stock and then actually install the mods. They have been by far the most frustrating part of the whole thing. However, it was motivating to have already built the machine and seen it in action, providing a heartfelt validation that it could be done. That helps keep you to keep pushing through the mod frustration later.

Hopefully this doesn't scare you, because truthfully the build is a LOT of fun. I for one am very happy with it all, even with the modding. Just keep in mind, experienced advice is experienced for a reason; consider it carefully. Life is so much better that way; I need to work on it more myself too.
Hey Thanks for dropping by Mxbrnr,
I am here to get advice from every angle, including those such as yourself who Advise me to express caution, I havnt actually built a Voron myself yet and it looks like a jolly exciting adventure. I do have quite a bit of experience in Non adative machinery such as CNC having built a couple of quite complex 8' x 4' Milling machones in steelwith ATC, VFDs and all, I realise its not going to be like lego even with that experience but im here to learn and so far im thankful people such as yourself are willing to drop by and give me your 2 cents worth.

As i said at the begining im not going to rule out a kit. But i do want to explore the best use of my cash and minimise wasting money on items im not going to end up using. im going to try and not bite off more than i can chew if i can avoid it. in this short thread i have already changed my opinion on the tap for example and am now leaqning towards the "Beacon" as it has less limitations than the tap both mass and temperature wise, that said its very likely that there are other suggestions to be considered as well. I am just at the start of the journey and nothing is really decided. I will take your caution with thanks you took the time to post it, I too am old enough to listen and be greatful for any advice i can get from those with more experience.

Regards
Rick
 
Hi NoGuru,
Thanks for your input, Although i am considering a Kit the Jury is still out as although i think its less hassle i think the kits i have looked at although good quality have limiting factors to my choices. Now this is why i posted the question in the first place, you mentioned "Beacon" i had never heard of it. So about 5 videos later here i am, i must admit the speed it does a bed mesh beats the Tap hands down so what you have done is give me another train of thought and i really thank you for that, make no mistake i will take a couple of days to read and watch as much material on the beacon as i can. With the CAN question i have digested a huge amount of information regarding it and i think what may be scary to some is its configuration and the extra coding involved, the hardware itself seems quite streight forward. As for the coding and configuration im not too phased by it either, i have a little experience from a past life as a software engineer. As for the snap latches i was sold the moment i followed your link :) They look fab. Now the ACM panels do look like a great option having better UV light, heat, age and enviroment stability so like you say they would make an ideal back and bottom panel, as for the cost... Well that ship sailed the moment i decided to go down the Voron Route and to be fair i want quality and longevity so ACM is definitly in the running.

Again thanks so much for your input and i hope we speak again.

Regards
Rick
I'm glad you are self sourcing, you WILL make a better machine. Going back to Beacon, it is what I will consider the best probe out so far with the caveat that I don't know longevity. It does sit very close to my nozzle and runs about 80c while I print so, time will tell. The speed and accuracy is outstanding.
Sounds like you are sold on a CAN network as well. My advise is always buy 2 CAN boards in case 1 let's out the magic. The second is map out the entire CAN setup from how you are going to umbilical it to how you will flash the board and what printed models you will need to use the Network.

One other mod I made that I always forget about but love. 6mm Acrylic panels. The stock, I think are 2mm or something, are flimsy and let out a lot of heat. 6mm might be a bit large but it really was overall much better once I get them on. Although 5mm might have been better for tolerances.
 
I'm glad you are self sourcing, you WILL make a better machine. Going back to Beacon, it is what I will consider the best probe out so far with the caveat that I don't know longevity. It does sit very close to my nozzle and runs about 80c while I print so, time will tell. The speed and accuracy is outstanding.
Sounds like you are sold on a CAN network as well. My advise is always buy 2 CAN boards in case 1 let's out the magic. The second is map out the entire CAN setup from how you are going to umbilical it to how you will flash the board and what printed models you will need to use the Network.

One other mod I made that I always forget about but love. 6mm Acrylic panels. The stock, I think are 2mm or something, are flimsy and let out a lot of heat. 6mm might be a bit large but it really was overall much better once I get them on. Although 5mm might have been better for tolerances.

Hi NoGuru
I Must admit i havnt discounted the full kit from LDO but to be honest i want the journey not just the printer. I want it to be "My Voron" not just "A Voron" i dont want to Reinvent the wheel but i want custom from the getgo if i dont get a kit i suppose I also want the challenge, I know there are many who will say maybe its unwise, but although I value their input this maybe my first Voron rodeo but its certainly not my first Custom build 3D printer rodeo, I have had several including SLA. I know this is a very different proposition but im here to gather all the information i can and then make a decision.

So far as Beacon is concerned i was looking at that exact point and wondered if a modification to the cooling system might be able to keep the temp of the board lower than it might otherwise be, i guess i will have to watch for the experiences of others such as yourself to see if i have to give its cooling any extra consideration.

You see the Acrylic sheet thickness is an excelent point that i would never have even thought about so thanks, i expect i will follow suit as 2mm does seem rather flimsy.

Yes i am sold on CAN I will however just use the smallest drag chain i can as opposeed to having an umbilical. I have a little experience with Drag chains and umbilical from my CNC building past. So Its Drag chain for me..

Thanks for taking the time to revisit this thread it really is a massive help to me when poeople like yourself share your experiences with me.

Kind Regards
Rick
 
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