What features would you like to see in 0.3?

[BendandSend]

Printer Model

Voron 0

I've just finished building my 0.1-S1 from LDO. Awesome kit, I had a lot of fun building and just as much fun picking out future mods and adjustments! I have already moved my unit towards being more of a 0.2 when I started to think... what improvements would I like to see to these kits? Personally, the two big ones I would love to see are:

- Auto Bed levelling for pretty obvious reasons

- A fixed print bed much like Prusa and Bambu as I believe bed springs are a bit of a step back in terms of reliability and sustainability as well as a possible weak point in terms of quality due to fast speeds may cause the tensioning nuts to loosen after several prints.

What are your thoughts? What quality of life improvements would you like to see in a newer design of this small yet mighty design!?

 

[Sanity Agathion]

Hello, I think some probe could be OK but will be very hard to cram one in.
As for springs - I personally would rather have bed physically as best levelled and perpendicular to Z as possible, before relying strictly on mesh.

 

[BendandSend]

Hello, I think some probe could be OK but will be very hard to cram one in.
As for springs - I personally would rather have bed physically as best levelled and perpendicular to Z as possible, before relying strictly on mesh.

That's fair enough not to be rude, but could you tell me what would make a probe difficult to fit? I am going through the process of trying to install one for the experience, so I would just like to know if it could be finding space on the board or on the hotend housing?

Also, isn't mesh a good way of achieving a perpendicular bed to the x and y rails? I probably should add that when I say "fix the bed in place" I mean more like using the original or shorter screws that feed through the print bed (and held in place with a nylock nut) then using two addition lock nuts either side of your print bed support so that you can then do fine tuning, but now when you lock both nuts either side of the print bed support, everything becomes rigid. Much like the Prusa MK3's Nylock nut mod. I hope this makes sense, it's just a lot to try and portray

 

[NoGuru]

Probe = No for me.
Bed springs = yes for me. I know both of these are opposite from your opinion but I will tell you why. The bed is tiny. In fact it is so small I have only leveled it once using the paper method and its perfect, never changes. And with the bed springs, its less complex. Why add complexity where its not needed. Keep them on the tighter side if you fear the nuts dropping off but this method has been used on thousands of printers with no issue.

When you get into bigger printers like a Trident or 2.4, both of those things do become important due to the size.

The improvements I would like to see if better panels, panel retainers and improved cooling to both the hotend and electronics bay.

 

[Sanity Agathion]

That's fair enough not to be rude, but could you tell me what would make a probe difficult to fit? I am going through the process of trying to install one for the experience, so I would just like to know if it could be finding space on the board or on the hotend housing?

Also, isn't mesh a good way of achieving a perpendicular bed to the x and y rails? I probably should add that when I say "fix the bed in place" I mean more like using the original or shorter screws that feed through the print bed (and held in place with a nylock nut) then using two addition lock nuts either side of your print bed support so that you can then do fine tuning, but now when you lock both nuts either side of the print bed support, everything becomes rigid. Much like the Prusa MK3's Nylock nut mod. I hope this makes sense, it's just a lot to try and portray

You are absolutely not rude, ask away! I appreciate fruitful discussion. I am just expressing my opinions v0 has really not much space in toolhead itself and around it. nemgrea tries to every mm posible. With current toolhead, there are some solutions to put at least Klicky mount - but at the expense of either some few mm lost X space, or the use of servo.
That's with current toolhead - Mini-SB. Maybe new toolhead could address this and have a space for probe embedded? Although, recently very popular Dragonburner faces the same issue (and that thing crams even more cooling capacity in there).

I thought you meant rigid mount like with Prusa standoffs, without the possibility to adjust. This could work with a probe you attach once, adjust screw, remove, put into drawer, and newxt time use only when first layer starts to break.

 

[BendandSend]

You are absolutely not rude, ask away! I appreciate fruitful discussion. I am just expressing my opinions v0 has really not much space in toolhead itself and around it. nemgrea tries to every mm posible. With current toolhead, there are some solutions to put at least Klicky mount - but at the expense of either some few mm lost X space, or the use of servo.
That's with current toolhead - Mini-SB. Maybe new toolhead could address this and have a space for probe embedded? Although, recently very popular Dragonburner faces the same issue (and that thing crams even more cooling capacity in there).

I thought you meant rigid mount like with Prusa standoffs, without the possibility to adjust. This could work with a probe you attach once, adjust screw, remove, put into drawer, and newxt time use only when first layer starts to break.

No problems whatsoever! The IR prove I have ordered is this one here. it was mentioned by Teachingtech (this video) as being only 3grams, though ill have to see with how mounting goes. I am definitely thinking of using the Dragonburner for the cooling, and I feel I may be able to adjust the cowling a little to be able to screw the probe either on the inside or outside and through the bottom fan mounting holes... if its the correct height haha. if not, I'm not too shabby with CAD so ill take a bash at it myself

I really do like the idea of being able to fix the bed once, knowing that it is flat and that no amount of vibrations could risk the bed shifting or loosening. I know its a tiny risk, but if I can eliminate it completely, I will enjoy the challenge to do so I'm going waaaaaaaaaaay overboard with my 0.1, but thanks to the community and the fun I've had with building it, I want to learn as much as I can and see if there is anything at all I can offer back to the community. I also like the discussion of what would make building a 0.3 worthwhile by looking around at whats on the newer printers that make printing a joy to use while offering the opportunity to learn newer approaches to printing.

All in all, I'm enjoying everything Voron so far and I cant wait to see what the future offers up and what we can all offer!

 

[BendandSend]

Probe = No for me.
Bed springs = yes for me. I know both of these are opposite from your opinion but I will tell you why. The bed is tiny. In fact it is so small I have only leveled it once using the paper method and its perfect, never changes. And with the bed springs, its less complex. Why add complexity where its not needed. Keep them on the tighter side if you fear the nuts dropping off but this method has been used on thousands of printers with no issue.

When you get into bigger printers like a Trident or 2.4, both of those things do become important due to the size.

The improvements I would like to see if better panels, panel retainers and improved cooling to both the hotend and electronics bay.

I'm thoroughly considering building a Trident at some point, but for now I'm just trying out and soaking up everything I can by going overboard with my 0.1 anything that seems overkill on my 0.1 I can put aside for the Trident.

I thoroughly agree with your suggestions! I saw the panel snap latches on Printables and kinda kicked myself for not finding them sooner. I will probably be implementing these on my rear panel to make accessing the electronics far easier. I will be using the Dragonburner cowl for my hotend which should provide more part cooling using the 4010 blower fans. As I said, I'm gonna go overboard with this printer so I'm installing a BTT SKR 3 EZ board so that I can install closed loop stepper drivers. Cooling will definitely be something I have to take a closer look at, but as stock I still agree that better cooling would be a good idea, maybe even utilising Modesty Mesh and have the panels stop at the back plate (maybe against another extrusion?) and have the modesty mesh allow extra venting of warm air?

 

[transonic_gecko]

Probe = No for me.
Bed springs = yes for me. I know both of these are opposite from your opinion but I will tell you why. The bed is tiny. In fact it is so small I have only leveled it once using the paper method and its perfect, never changes. And with the bed springs, its less complex. Why add complexity where its not needed. Keep them on the tighter side if you fear the nuts dropping off but this method has been used on thousands of printers with no issue.

When you get into bigger printers like a Trident or 2.4, both of those things do become important due to the size.

The improvements I would like to see if better panels, panel retainers and improved cooling to both the hotend and electronics bay.

This is my experience, as well. The bed is so small that I seriously never have to relevel it. I do appreciate how thick the bed is, as well, which I believe also helps in this regard. Compared with my thin aluminum bed on my CR-10, this small 120x120 bed is super easy to deal with. Probe=no, springs=yes from me, as well.

As for my vote on improvements, I'd like to see the following:

1. Something like the Kirigami bed become the standard mount, if possible (I'm not sure how licensing works here).
2. Some specification on the anti-backlash spring since the one that came in my LDO v0.2-s1 kit was way too strong and I had to remove it to prevent z motor skips.
3. More "permanent" mounting solution for the PSU that doesn't really on adhesives (I know this is probably fine as-is, but I just don't like it).

Honestly, I'm pretty happy overall even without these suggestions.

 

[Khay]

I'd like to see a solution for the "shit, I have forgotten to put a nut in that rail" problem. And maybe change from MGN7 to MGN9 on X.

 

[transonic_gecko]

I'd like to see a solution for the "shit, I have forgotten to put a nut in that rail" problem. And maybe change from MGN7 to MGN9 on X.

The LDO kits ship with a ton of square nuts that can be used specifically for this purpose -- you can slide them in at an angle and then tighten them up flush.

 

[claudermilk]

The LDO kits ship with a ton of square nuts that can be used specifically for this purpose -- you can slide them in at an angle and then tighten them up flush.

Can confirm. I just started my LDO V0.2 build yesterday. I forgot about those and it just hit me a few minutes before reading this post that the big pile of square nuts was those. You can find them here for example.

 

[Sanity Agathion]

1. Something like the Kirigami bed become the standard mount, if possible (I'm not sure how licensing works here).

Kirigami won't become spec, regardless of how Nemgrea himself and other people adore it. It's a custom-made part, VORON philosophy is to make printers from common parts which can be bought worldwide.

 

[transonic_gecko]

Kirigami won't become spec, regardless of how Nemgrea himself and other people adore it. It's a custom-made part, VORON philosophy is to make printers from common parts which can be bought worldwide.

That's fair, I hadn't really thought about it like that. I would support that philosophy -- users can always purchase their own "fancy" upgrades, if desired.

That said, it was included in my LDO kit and I do like it.

 

[Sanity Agathion]

That's fair, I hadn't really thought about it like that. I would support that philosophy -- users can always purchase their own "fancy" upgrades, if desired.

That said, it was included in my LDO kit and I do like it.

I totally get it, it's a well thought out piece of hardware.

 

[akanar]

No more VHB tape to mount electronics. Should only be used on the door.

 

[NoGuru]

These Cams I just installed

 

[Sanity Agathion]

These Cams I just installed
View attachment 2925

Interesting.

Cam locks are new too, with r1. Uses hex key (can be printed)

 

[Driftrotor]

I have to say that the bed for me personally is spot on, only had to level it once as others have said and have had zero issues with it.
So I'd be in the category of bed springs = yes, ABL probe = no.

The top hat is much improved with the v0.2 variants but the cabling to the hotend still has issues (rubbing and wot not) so I'd like something to address this.

Maybe CanBus might be nice but I don't think it would come about because of added weight to the hotend.

Definitely better part cooling, it has been improved by the R1 version release but still needs further improvement in my opinion. don't get me wrong it does a good job with the space constraints but I found I had to get good fans to maximise its performance.

A move away from VHB tape would be nice, i get that its a good compromise as it does the job well but it just feels a bit Heath Robinson.

Better panel mounting. i change between PLA and ABS etc so removing the panels is the easy part but putting them back on is another all together.
I combatted this by designing push in magnet holders so my panels are held in with them. makes the whole removal and refitting a doddle and literally takes seconds to do.

Maybe some frame bracing to make it extra rigid?
After i installed some to my V0.2 my acceleration values went up quite nicely.

Better cooling for the electronics.
I have a dedicated fan for both my RPI and MCU both running PID control and this works really very well. keeping fan noise to a minimum and it holds the temps really stable.

Better cable management for the electronics bay.
I know this is mainly down to what you have in there and the space left over and the orientation / how you mount your gubbins but this i feel might be an improvement over just leaving it to the user to decide if / how they want to do it.

Some sort of electrical plug / interface for running cooling fans / filter fans would be nice as i think a lot of people use these.

Maybe KAMP and TMC-AUTO TUNE would be nice additions to the software side but I'm sure this is more personal preference.

Apart from that lot I really love this little printer. its a proper work horse and is run nearly every day for me so far.
But these are just idea's of what would be really nice to have on a V0.3

 

[NoGuru]

I have to say that the bed for me personally is spot on, only had to level it once as others have said and have had zero issues with it.
So I'd be in the category of bed springs = yes, ABL probe = no.

The top hat is much improved with the v0.2 variants but the cabling to the hotend still has issues (rubbing and wot not) so I'd like something to address this.

Maybe CanBus might be nice but I don't think it would come about because of added weight to the hotend.

Definitely better part cooling, it has been improved by the R1 version release but still needs further improvement in my opinion. don't get me wrong it does a good job with the space constraints but I found I had to get good fans to maximise its performance.

A move away from VHB tape would be nice, i get that its a good compromise as it does the job well but it just feels a bit Heath Robinson.

Better panel mounting. i change between PLA and ABS etc so removing the panels is the easy part but putting them back on is another all together.
I combatted this by designing push in magnet holders so my panels are held in with them. makes the whole removal and refitting a doddle and literally takes seconds to do.

Maybe some frame bracing to make it extra rigid?
After i installed some to my V0.2 my acceleration values went up quite nicely.

Better cooling for the electronics.
I have a dedicated fan for both my RPI and MCU both running PID control and this works really very well. keeping fan noise to a minimum and it holds the temps really stable.

Better cable management for the electronics bay.
I know this is mainly down to what you have in there and the space left over and the orientation / how you mount your gubbins but this i feel might be an improvement over just leaving it to the user to decide if / how they want to do it.

Some sort of electrical plug / interface for running cooling fans / filter fans would be nice as i think a lot of people use these.

Maybe KAMP and TMC-AUTO TUNE would be nice additions to the software side but I'm sure this is more personal preference.

Apart from that lot I really love this little printer. its a proper work horse and is run nearly every day for me so far.
But these are just idea's of what would be really nice to have on a V0.3

I would like to see what you did for panel mounting? Can you indulge more?

I have not considered bracing and I have seen the braces that are like the VzBot. Now I will probably make some to see if it give any performance gains.

I just did the TMC auto tune on my V0 and it did in fact reduce some coil wine, so I do like it.

 

[zruncho]

I have to say that the bed for me personally is spot on, only had to level it once as others have said and have had zero issues with it.
So I'd be in the category of bed springs = yes, ABL probe = no.

The top hat is much improved with the v0.2 variants but the cabling to the hotend still has issues (rubbing and wot not) so I'd like something to address this.

Maybe CanBus might be nice but I don't think it would come about because of added weight to the hotend.

Definitely better part cooling, it has been improved by the R1 version release but still needs further improvement in my opinion. don't get me wrong it does a good job with the space constraints but I found I had to get good fans to maximise its performance.

A move away from VHB tape would be nice, i get that its a good compromise as it does the job well but it just feels a bit Heath Robinson.

Better panel mounting. i change between PLA and ABS etc so removing the panels is the easy part but putting them back on is another all together.
I combatted this by designing push in magnet holders so my panels are held in with them. makes the whole removal and refitting a doddle and literally takes seconds to do.

Maybe some frame bracing to make it extra rigid?
After i installed some to my V0.2 my acceleration values went up quite nicely.

Better cooling for the electronics.
I have a dedicated fan for both my RPI and MCU both running PID control and this works really very well. keeping fan noise to a minimum and it holds the temps really stable.

Better cable management for the electronics bay.
I know this is mainly down to what you have in there and the space left over and the orientation / how you mount your gubbins but this i feel might be an improvement over just leaving it to the user to decide if / how they want to do it.

Some sort of electrical plug / interface for running cooling fans / filter fans would be nice as i think a lot of people use these.

Maybe KAMP and TMC-AUTO TUNE would be nice additions to the software side but I'm sure this is more personal preference.

Apart from that lot I really love this little printer. its a proper work horse and is run nearly every day for me so far.
But these are just idea's of what would be really nice to have on a V0.3

Have you shared the before/after-frame-bracing resonance results? Would be very interested.